On Thursday 6th March LOFT hosted its second meeting with Orient Chairman Barry Hearn. As with last year's event, the evening was primarily a Question-and-Answer session; however, as an introduction, Barry Hearn was invited to talk about what had happened in football and at Orient since he spoke to us 15 months ago.
BH replied that it had been a traumatic time. The demise of ITV digital had probably not been such a bad thing in the long run as it had been a wake-up call. Meanwhile, it had been another year of inconsistency on the pitch. However, BH wanted to emphasize that Orient is a club with ambition despite the football we've been forced to watch. He believes that we have a strong side, but would use the words "abject failure" to describe its achievements on the pitch.
This leaves the club with the chance to be ambitious off the pitch - which it will achieve if the current redevelopment plans go through. Without prompting, BH emphasized that he would be "intransigent" about standing, pointing out that he, like LOFT members, spoke from the heart. He enjoys debating - "I believe in democracy - up to a point".
BH said that he was still enjoying himself at Orient, although he didn't know why. He would blame himself and the players (but not the management) for the lack of achievement to date.
He was disappointed to lose Smith, but would never have wanted to prevent him from joining a 1st Division club. As for the rest of the side, cuts have been made, and will continue to be made. He believes the club has made great signings in Miller and Alexander.
The changes brought about by the collapse of ITV Digital and the increasing unwillingness of chairmen to pay such high wages has meant that there is a huge pool of available players. It is this scenario that is making him question the need for a reserve team, or even a youth team. Why spend £200-400K on the youth set up when there is experienced talent out there to pick up? He spoke about Orient's growing links with Charlton, how a manager like Curbishly sees the advantage in loaning out youngsters so is prepared to do a good deal - this sort of connection could be the future for finding new talent
Back to the ground redevelopments, BH delivered a now familiar warning; without the development, we will not be at Brisbane Road in the future. He mentioned that the West Stand was "a phone-call away" from being condemned. He also reiterated his belief that terracing is a thing of the past, although he understands the emotion behind it.
The question and answer session covered many topics, but the most recurring topics were to do with the ground redevelopments, and the financial situation of Orient and clubs in general.
Money matters and wage capping
When asked about the budget for the first team, BH said that next year's budget would be £1.25m as opposed to £1.5m last year. He then revealed that there was to be vote on wage capping held by Third Division Chairmen soon. BH believes it will be accepted unanimously. The proposed wage cap will be 60% of net turnover. He believes the Football League will be very supportive, because it will drive home the message to chairmen to not spend money that does not exist.
BH was insistent that Orient fans would not suffer from an increase in prices to try and increase turnover. He believes there is "no future" in extorting money from loyal fans. Prices will not rise this year, or in fact until Orient is promoted.
He then sketched out the maths for us; the club's current net turnover is £2m; that would give Paul Brush a budget of £1.2m. He was quick to point out that the ground redevelopments, with the lettable spaces, mean an extra £500,000 a year turnover, increasing the amount that could be spent on players...
Barry Hearn believes that the chairmen will not only accept the wage cap but abide by it too. This is partly because of the proposed deterrents - such as fines, points deduction or even expulsion for not complying - but also because he believes it is the chairmen who want to bring football's finances under control. He thought the PFA were showing a "frightening lack of reality" about the issue.
A few questions were asked on the subject of Orient players' contracts; BH stated that no contracts will be negotiated until he has a better idea of what the final League position will be.
Later, BH was asked if he considered the club to be "ahead of the game" when it came to adjusting for the new financial realities in football. He said that he thought so, but that one wouldn't think so from looking at the accounts! He said that they had increased corporate earnings, but spent much more on players. He believes they have made the losses less than they would have been.
BH gave us his "cynical" view that the average fan doesn't care about the financial picture, repeating his anecdote of when he asked fans if they'd prefer money to be spent on the ground or on a striker, they went for the striker. Needless to say, there was much denial of this by the members present, who pointed out that most people were now very aware of the financial constraints in football.
Ground redevelopments
BH was asked if he would consider retaining North Terrace prices in another part of the ground. He pointed out that developments would not start until September at least, which would mean that North Terrace season ticket holders would be re-housed at no additional cost. He may consider cheaper tickets in other parts of the ground; and he repeated his earlier assertion that there was no point in upsetting loyal and long-standing supporters. He stated that he wanted to hear our views on issues like pricing. Maintaining a price differential seems to be common sense, particularly as he wants to attract more local people.
On the subject of capacity, BH was insistent that people could not criticise about "lack of ambition" as evidence by proposed capacity, particularly if they were arguing for a retention of standing. He asked where people were getting the 7,500 figure from, and when people replied that that was what was on the plans, he argued that only if the East Stand was completed would the capacity be that low. At the moment, plans to develop the East Stand are a long way off.
When asked why he was so confrontational, considering that the plans are by no means guaranteed to go through, BH that at times it's necessary to lead from the front, and that he runs the business as he sees fit, because he puts the money in. He insisted that they had consulted people, but stated that the club have the right to disregard opinions given.
When asked what percentage of money from the flats would go into the team, BH pointed out that the sale of the land for the flats would finance the development of the ground (not the team). He said that the lease change (from 125 to 999 years, with the change of use clause) would be revoked if the money was not spent on the ground - the minimum he has to spend on developing the ground is the maximum earned from the sale of the land, and there must be Open Book Accounting, which will be scrutinised by the council. He reckons that they will overspend slightly on the developments - and this overspending will increase the longer the developments are delayed.
Leyton Orient Football Club will be the owner of the lettable spaces, although they will probably contract out the estate management if they have many tenants (they are hoping to get one or two large tenants though). BH is confident that the spaces will be let. He is sure that Orient can appeal to the business community, and spoke with great pride about the fact that there were "450 new season ticket-holders" thanks to the scheme where local businesses were sold a package of 4 season-ticket holders. People want to be in the South Stand; and the club's research tells them there is much more potential for attracting this kind of corporate client.
BH was challenged about his assertion that the club would have to move if the plans didn't go through. He insisted it would be cheaper to move than redevelop; and that although he couldn't think about anything beyond the development at the moment, if it failed, he'd have to consider other options. He said he'd look for the best deal, whether that would be Hackney, Romford, Eton manor or whatever.
BH was invited to explain why he was so dead set against retaining terracing. He believes it is a "thing of the past", pointing out that there has been a steady fall in the number of North Terrace season ticket-holders (from 356 to 189 between last season and this) and a "migration to the South Stand". He believes that "new" supporters require new facilities, and that the 125 packages sold to businessmen were sold on the basis of the South stand and its facilities, e.g the restaurant and the bar.
When it was suggested that people would be more interested in a modern standing area, i.e. one with a roof and walls, he said that, by building a standing area, the club would lose the £1m funding we have secured from the Football Trust. He was insistent on this, saying that there was a "new regime" in place, which had a different attitude to that which authorised funding for terracing at Halifax and Exeter.
And finally... BH was asked why he was Chairman of Orient. "They came to me and I fell for it"; a group of club dignitaries including Tony Wood asked him to think about it. "I should never have gone to the ground" - that was when he started to feel "nostalgic". But he was insistent that he has never regretted taking it on.
Click here to read about last year's meeting.
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